Katie Couric: I think the only entity that you all hate as much as the Boulder Police is the press. Tell me about the lengths that people in my business went to get at you.

Patsy Ramsey: They stole our trash. They hid in trees, in shrubbery.

John Ramsey: We've been followed to Europe.

Katie Couric: Someone came to your church, I understand, saying they wanted to..

John Ramsey: We apparently..

Katie Couric: convert to Christianity?

John Ramsey: we apparently filled the church every Sunday. It was largely the tabloid media is what we finally figured out.

Patsy Ramsey: All of those writers must have gotten straight A's in creative writing is all I can figure. Because they're very creative.

Katie Couric: In other words, much of what was printed about you was just completely and utterly fabricated?

John Ramsey: Utterly. All of is was false.

Katie Couric: You talk about the tabloids. We - actually pulled these tabloids that all feature..

John Ramsey: So you only have a few of them, I see.

Patsy Ramsey: Uh-huh (affirmative).

Katie Couric: ,,,you on the front page.

Patsy Ramsey: Uh-huh (affirmative).

John Ramsey: Yeah. It's..

Katie Couric: "JonBenet. Mom did it alone. She killed little beauty for wetting her bed." (Katie reads from one of the tabloids.)

Patsy Ramsey: Uh-huh (affirmative).

Katie Couric: "JonBenet rape shocker." (Katie reads from another tabloid.) What was it like seeing these headlines week after week? Or did you see them?

John Ramsey: Well, you can't avoid 'em. They're in the supermarkets. They're in the drugstores. This was the same kind of magazine that a - you know, a few years ago is publishing, you know, a two-headed alien born in Oklahoma. And I used to look and think, "Wow, I wonder? Nah. Probably not." (Laughter) And now, they've focused on my family. And I can't help but think that most of the people that walk by these things look at that and say, "Huh. I wonder?"

Patsy Ramsey: Uh-huh (affirmative).

Katie Couric: I think they do.

John Ramsey: And I think they do too.

Patsy Ramsey: The media is so powerful. They can formulate public opinion in this country. They say, "Looking for pornography." They don't say, "Didn't find any." They say, "Looking for previous sexual abuse." They don't report, "Never found any." (Laughs). You know, all of it is so insinuating.

Katie Couric: You all write about so-called urban legends that have circulated false information or false impressions that..

John Ramsey: Uh-huh (affirmative).

Katie Couric: sort of added up to give the overall feeling that you

John Ramsey: Uh-huh (affirmative).

Katie Couric: were guilty.

Patsy Ramsey: Were guilty. Right.

Katie Couric: For example, it could not have been an intruder because there were no footprints in the snow.

John Ramsey: The fact of the matter is I've seen photos that were taken early that morning by the police. There was - there were patches of snow, but there were a lot of clear spaces, particularly on the patio that is adjacent to the basement window.

Katie Couric: You left the house for a time that morning.

John Ramsey: I left the house for probably five seconds. I went out on the patio. I went around to the - we had another exterior garage door. I wanted to see if it was locked.

Katie Couric: That one January morning when cameras caught you all coming out of church down the aisle of members of the..

John Ramsey: Uh-huh (affirmative).

Katie Couric: congregation who had gathered - that you had set the whole thing up. It was a publicity stunt.

John Ramsey: We were accused of that. The fact of the matter was that our minister in the service said, "Look, this is what's gonna happen. There's gonna be a lot of cameras out there. But I'm gonna change the rules. I want all of you who are supporting the Ramseys to line up along the sidewalk and show the world that we support them."And everybody did. It was wonderful.

Katie Couric: You were unemotional.

John Ramsey: When?

Katie Couric: In general. People interpreted your behavior as unemotional or somehow inappropriate or not proper in terms of how one should behave if one is grieving.

John Ramsey: Well, I have grieved for the loss of two children. I have grieved for the loss of my parents. If you want to see me grieve, I'll call you some evening at three in the morning when I've woken up and I've had this stark image of my daughter when I found her. And you'll see me grieve.

Katie Couric: After a 13-month grand jury investigation, you all were so convinced that you were going to be indicted, that you actually went to Boulder prepared to turn yourselves in to authorities.

JR: 'We've been tried, convicted, and probably in some people's minds executed in the public court.'

John Ramsey: We were convinced that the system hadn't worked for three years. And why should we expect it to work now? Yeah. We had - we had no fear of a trial. We had no doubt about the outcome of a trial. None. Katie Couric: Given you had no doubt, do you ever wish there had been a trial?

John Ramsey: We've talked about that often. We say

Patsy Ramsey: There are some good - there are some benefits to that. Because we would have been able to obtain all of the evidence.

John Ramsey: We've had the worst so far. We've been - we have never been officially named as suspects by the Boulder Police. We've been

Patsy Ramsey: Under the umbrella

John Ramsey: under the umbrella of suspicion.

Patsy Ramsey: suspicion.

John Ramsey: But yet, we've been tried, convicted, and probably in some people's minds executed in the public court.

Patsy Ramsey: Without benefit of a trial.

Katie Couric: Some believe that because the grand jury failed to indict, it doesn't mean that it exonerated you. That it could have been simply there was not enough evidence to indict, but that doesn't mean you are innocent.

John Ramsey: You know how much evidence it takes to indict on probable cause at a grand jury? It's about that much. And it takes about that much (horn) to convict.

John Ramsey: Well, it was - it was horribly disappointing. Because what he needed to say, in our minds, was, "I'm going to find the killer of this child. We're gonna put investigators on this case that have homicide experience. We're gonna continue with resources until we find the killer."

Katie Couric: You all must have been furious, more than just disappointed?

Patsy Ramsey: Well, we were amazed. I mean...

John Ramsey: It was shocking.

Patsy Ramsey: ...isn't he stepping on the Constitution, or am I readin' things wrong?

Katie Couric: After the grand jury's action, a poll showed that 49 percent of the country still thought one of you was involved in your daughter's murder.

John Ramsey: I'm surprised it wasn't 100 percent. They'd been told that for three years.

Katie Couric: It's amazing when you - it's amazing when you hear about polls or public opinion...

John Ramsey: Uh-huh (affirmative).

Katie Couric: ...that, in general, actually completely you've been treated with a great deal of respect and kindness by strangers.

John Ramsey: Absolutely. We-we've been overwhelmed by the goodness that's come forward to us. Strangers that have come up to us. And we had two people on the way up...

Patsy Ramsey: Uh-huh (affirmative).

John Ramsey: ...for this interview that stopped us in the airport and said, "Aren't you JonBenet's parents?" And I'm always proud to say, "Yes, I am." And they said, "Well, I just want you to know I'm sorry for what's happened to you."

Katie Couric: Let me ask you about your close friend, Fleet White. Because that's one of these strange sort of areas...

John Ramsey: Uh-huh (affirmative).

Katie Couric: ...in this case. You spent Christmas Day together. He was with you when you found JonBenet's body. And yet, just a week later it was reported that he got angry at you for hiring lawyers and not cooperating more with the police. And you haven't spoken since. And in fact, he's twice asked the Governor'soffice to appoint a special prosecutor to further investigate you. So a man who used to be your best friend is behaving this way. What gives?

John Ramsey: The best that I can figure - and we know this had happened to other people who've told us this - the police would go to our friends and say, "Katie, the Ramseys think you had something to do with the death of their daughter. Would you talk to us?" I believe that they did that to Fleet White.

Katie Couric: It sounds at face value that he thinks you were involved.

Patsy Ramsey: I don't know.

John Ramsey: No. I can't...

Patsy Ramsey: We - we...

John Ramsey: ... I can't accept that.

Patsy Ramsey: ...can't explain it.

Katie Couric: Do you think he could have been involved in this at all?

John Ramsey: No. I don't. They had a nice family. We spent lot of time together; our families did.

PR: 'It was very painful to look at houses with a number of bedrooms because it brought home so painfully the fact that we needed fewer bedrooms now, since we no longer had two children.'

Today the Ramseys are rebuilding their own family life in Atlanta, the home town they returned to in the spring of nineteen ninety-seven. John's eldest son, John Andrew, was dropped as a suspect in the case when he proved he'd been away the night JonBenet was killed. Now he is finishing up a college history degree. His sister Melinda lives in Virginia and is expecting a baby. The Boulder district attorney put a stop to tabloid rumors by officially clearing Burke Ramsey as a suspect last may. Today Burke is what his parents call, a typical thirteen-year-old.

Katie Couric: How is Burke doing through all this?

Patsy Ramsey:What we worry about with Burke is down the road. You know, you just don't know what kind of repercussions he may suffer from this long-term.

Katie Couric: Has he gotten professional help? Have you all ...

John Ramsey: Uh-huh (affirmative).

Katie Couric: ... gotten professional help to deal with this?

Patsy Ramsey: Oh, yeah.

John Ramsey: Yep.

Patsy Ramsey: Absolutely.

Katie Couric: What other residual effects have you all experienced from this ordeal?

Patsy Ramsey: Well, that was a big issue. It was very painful to look at houses with a number of bedrooms because it brought home so painfully the fact that we needed fewer bedrooms now, since we no longer had two children.

They are remodeling the house they eventually bought - and making sure it provides the sense of security they say - their Boulder home failed to give.

Katie Couric: Do you all have nightmares?

John Ramsey: Occasionally. Less now than I did.

Katie Couric: How are you all doing financially? John, you write about being fired...

John Ramsey: Uh-huh (affirmative).

Katie Couric: ... by General Electric, NBC's parent company when your company was sold to GE.

John Ramsey: Uh-huh (affirmative).

According to G.E., the company has a policy of not commenting on personnel matters.

Katie Couric: Are you working at all? Are you doing consulting...

John Ramsey: No.

Katie Couric: ...work?

John Ramsey: No. This is a pretty serious cloud over my head. I'm - it's difficult to expect people that I - that don't know me in a business environment to...

Katie Couric: To name you as employee of the month?

John Ramsey: Yeah. (Laughs)